Bon Iver

The waiting for Bonnaroo 2018 might just be over soon.

Day after day passes and we get closer and closer to Bonnaroo 2018.

Welcome to the What Podcast. That's Barry Courter from the Chattanooga Times-Free Press.

I'm Brad Steiner from HITS96 WDOD in Chattanooga, Tennessee.

I hate to start this episode out this way because I love Bon Iver so much.

But guys, Kanye West's favorite artist is playing Bon Iver this year.

I always gotta bring up Kanye.

Yeah, it all comes back to Kanye somehow.

Yeah, it does.

Bon Iver, the subject of this week's podcast.

Now, I would love to have secured a conversation with Justin

because there's nobody who's more fascinating in this industry than Justin.

But I would have been a nervous wreck because he's far, far smarter and far, far better at talking about this than I,

which I talk about Bon Iver a lot.

Yeah, and we're going to do that today.

And I'm glad you pointed it out.

We did not get him on the phone.

So this is just us talking about him.

This is going to irritate you, Barry.

At the end of today, you're going to be so irritated with me because you're going to hear this conversation

probably 45 more times between now and the end of Bon Iver.

I was driving over here.

I wondered, is Brad going to say this is his favorite act of all time?

Because I'm pretty sure you've said that every single week we've done this.

That's definitely not true.

And you know exactly who I'm talking about.

Yes.

Look, Bon Iver is, you know, for an artist that started out as an artist that guys only liked

so that they could, you know, take a girl home.

For me, that's how they started.

But they turned into, he might be one of the most unique artists that we have.

The man invents his own language.

He just doesn't speak the same words that we do.

No, I spent all morning listening to their music, his music.

And it occurred to me last night as I was listening, I can't compare this to anything else.

Right.

You know, I don't like doing that anyway.

Right.

But you can't help it with some things.

You know, you hear bits and pieces of something or somebody.

I can't, which is probably fine.

I shouldn't.

And then there's also, as I was listening, there are things in there that make me stare at the speaker.

Yeah.

I wonder, like, did somebody just walk in?

Is there somebody knocking on my window outside?

Did a car drive by?

What's that squeaking noise?

Yeah, sure.

There is just all kinds of glasses tinkling.

Right.

Yeah, I was looking over my shoulder all the time.

Were you a Bon Iver fan before, I guess, you found My Orbit?

Because I love Bon Iver and I talk about Bon Iver a lot.

Were you a big fan?

No.

Was it something that, no really?

No.

Like, he seems like something, especially the first album for Emma, seems like something that had been right up your alley.

Yeah, it is.

There's stuff, you know, there's some things that, whether it's just time or whatever, I just haven't stumbled across it.

It's not that I didn't like, I just didn't know, didn't know much about it, about the group.

To be honest, didn't, you know, know how to say it properly.

Right.

I think the first few years everybody was saying Bon Iver.

Bon Iver, yeah.

Looking up today, researching about the name, I should say they were into Winter Is Coming before anybody, right?

Well, you know, there's something about atmosphere and music, right?

There's something that takes you to a certain place.

And I find it to be quite ironic that the show that I'm most excited about this year on the farm,

in what will probably be 95 degree Tennessee heat, is a band that evokes so much coldness.

Everything that you hear from Bon Iver, I find to be just snow covered, completely snow covered.

Absolutely.

I don't know what having mononucleosis is like.

I don't know what winter's in Wisconsin are like.

I've never put myself into a cabin by myself in the winter in Wisconsin.

But when I listen to that album especially, I have to imagine that's what it's like.

Right, exactly.

That's what's so fantastic about at least the first two albums.

If you don't know much about the Bon Iver story, Justin, basically the heart and soul of it,

I equate him a lot like James Murphy from LCD Soundsystem,

in that they are the entire creative force behind a project.

So he goes through this crisis sometime in his mid-20s.

He has a breakup, he gets mono, he's living in North Carolina, he's feeling like a total failure.

Music's not going well for him, so he takes to his dad's cabin in Wisconsin.

And he shuts himself off from the world and eventually writes for Emma forever ago.

Wasn't intending to write anything.

Did not go there as a musical hiatus or working, I think, started writing.

And as I understand it, eventually came up with what he thought were some demos that he might could shop around.

And people convinced him that it was a record.

And you say for Emma, this is the 10-year anniversary.

We're going to talk about, he's doing two shows on the farm, so what will he do?

I know he did that entire album, but I think that was a one-off, so I don't know if we'll see some of that.

I have some ideas, and you can thank some industry people, you can thank some people from InfoRu and Reddit,

but I have some ideas about what the two shows will be.

But that's been the biggest question of this year.

What will Justin do? Because when it first came out, I said to you when we did the live show, it could be anything.

He literally could go in absolutely any direction.

I even said if he really wanted to, he could do an EDM show.

Well, you remember when we had Ashley Capps on third week.

We asked him, and he didn't know.

If he did, he wasn't telling, but I believe him.

I think his exact words is, I don't think Justin knows that.

Exactly. Exactly what he said. I'm sure he's thinking of it.

The thing that I love about the story of, and I hate the way that the story came about,

because it requires heartbreak and life-altering decisions that you have to make.

So for him, it's heartbreaking and hard to live through.

But for us, the story is so good, and I'll be honest with you,

after listening to For Emma, it sort of makes me want to be in a cabin in snow-covered woods.

That sort of sounds romantic to me right now.

Yeah.

Oh, running home, running home, running home, running home

Go find another lover to bring up, to string them on

Before your love is still very lovable

The love so many foreign roads

It's just an amazingly written album. It's so pretty. It's so beautiful.

It takes you straight to a time and a place where wherever he was in his life,

I'll put it this way, there's not an album I love more than something that takes me,

plucks me up from my space and my situation where I am, and then puts me right into theirs.

Yeah, and that's what an artist does. That's what a good artist does.

I was thinking about that as we were listening.

Sometimes, you know, and especially a musician will write something that we can completely identify with.

Heartbreak, breakup, whatever.

Sometimes, I can't remember who we talked about earlier in an earlier podcast,

probably Anderson Pat, talking about how that life, the life that he had coming up is not ours,

but we could identify with it because he, you know, it was presented and you're exactly right.

That album just transports you. It takes you to an entirely different place and you can't help but go.

I like the way you say that you can't help but go.

Even when he writes things that are so head scratching,

when he puts words together that don't really make any sense, I'm still right there with you.

Look, this is bizarre. If you go from doing nothing in North Carolina

and then going to some random place in Wisconsin, put together a demo tape and some songs,

and out of nowhere, you find blog culture.

I can't really remember if it was the start, but it was right there when music blog culture started blowing up, right?

Somewhere around 2006, 2007, he finds the attention of my old Kentucky blog.

And, you know, my old Kentucky blog blows it up and he becomes a viral indie rock sensation.

And it sounds pretty typical these days that, oh, yeah, internet star, got it.

But in 2007, did we have that many internet stars?

I mean, I think maybe Foster the People was one of them back then,

but, you know, that was when it really started to blossom and blow up.

It's interesting. Yeah, it was my old Kentucky blog and then Pitchfork.

And I think they printed, what, 500 copies of that first record and sent 12 to media types, mostly blogs.

I didn't get it, by the way. Did you get yours?

I didn't either. I wasn't blogging. We weren't on the list.

But, you know, we can sort of tie that circle even a little tighter.

Remember back in 2007 and 2002, as we've talked about, Bonnarooo helped change that whole music culture.

Bonnarooo changed the festival culture and then the internet and blogs and all that.

Sort of interesting talking to you sitting here in a radio station, of all things.

That's kind of when music changed.

I think people became more, it became cooler to have a playlist that did not include radio hits than the other.

And in my personal life, strangely enough, that is the exact year that our radio station went from cool indie rock to top 40.

The same exact year. We went the opposite direction.

Interesting. Yeah. My life and Justin's are exactly the same.

Probably about that time that I saw one of my favorite t-shirts at Bonnarooo that said, I'm into bands that don't even exist yet.

That's my dude. Yeah, exactly. I love that.

He hits on the blog and then he hits Bonnarooo 2009, right?

2009, if you go back and I've fancied myself in these podcasts now, going back and looking at where an artist was in relation to the poster and how it's sort of moved up.

Like look at 2009 when he first plays Bonnarooo. He's in between Girl Talk and Bella Fleck.

One, two, three, four, six lines down. That was Bruce. That was the Bruce year.

Bruce, Fish, Beastie Boys, Nine Inch Nails, David Byrne, Wilco, Al Green, Snoop Dogg. There's your top two lines.

Yeah, it is interesting to look back at that.

And like we talked about last week, those are sort of those do-over moments that I wish I could go back and see certain shows.

Right. But you don't know. That's one of those that you missed probably in 2000.

No question. This is a bit embarrassing, but I got off stage once at Bonnarooo, I think the first time we played.

I'm not totally crying all the time. I'm somewhat sensitive, but not a huge crier.

Got off stage and it was a great show. Like we thrashed it. I think Sean broke a bunch of drums.

And it was so good. Like it was such a good feeling and I just was so not there.

I had to go so far in a weird direction to be there properly. It's a very sensitive thing to say, but it's true.

Yeah, I just think as we look forward, we really want to just try to make every concert experience

or if we're going to play music, let's have it mean something.

We put together a set of our gear that just like packs away into smaller cases. They become pretty large.

Here's what I remember. One of my favorite moments from 2009.

And then when Bon Iver came back a few years later, both the same songs.

And I hate that it's the big hit, but Justin sitting in a chair and playing Skinny Love for what felt like a tent crowd that never ended.

Come on, Skinny Love, just let's see it.

It was a poor little soul, we were never here.

My, my, my, my, my, my, my.

Staring at the sinker light across the window.

So my love to wreck it all.

Cut out all the ropes and let me fall.

My, my, my, my, my, my, my.

Right in this moment, it's all just fine.

So there's some good and some bads about Skinny Love.

It's a brilliant song. It's so pretty. Listen how pretty it is.

It's gorgeous and it's amazing live. The only problem I have with it is that it created a culture of everyone's a singer songwriter.

It is played at every open mic that has ever existed since 2008.

And it probably will always. It's like when cameras got really good on your phone, everybody became a photographer.

When Skinny Love came out, everybody's a singer songwriter.

Yeah, because you get to be so earnest. Oh yeah, right.

You get to really give it back to that girl that broke your heart. Exactly.

You get to prove how earnest you are. Right. I always use that word earnest. Like church folk music. Right.

Going back to that whole locking himself in the cabin kind of thing. It really transformed him.

Not just musically, but I mean that talk about finding yourself. Right. He seems like a guy who's always trying to find himself.

That's what makes him so interesting to me is because if I had a little bit more intelligence and I was a little bit more neurotic and I was a little bit more how could I be?

Yeah, right. I think that I would be doing the exact same thing as he would.

Locking myself in a cabin and trying to disassociate from the world and refine myself and probably go through that every few years.

Yeah, I think we're going to hear a bit of an interview from him later where he talks about performing.

And it's interesting to hear and to think about sometimes artists like that who go so deep, deeply introspective.

They don't always want to go out and share because it's so personal and all. Well, look at Neutral Milk Hotel.

Yeah. I mean the man put his life and soul into two albums and it broke him. It's like I got to get the hell out of here.

That's what I mean. And then to go relive it. Yeah. You know, for 90 minutes or two hours. For a year and a half.

For a year and a half. That'd be hard to do.

This is him talking. It sort of gets you to the heart and soul of what the show is going to be at Bonnarooo.

So if you're looking for clues and trying to figure out what exactly they're going to do for two sets,

I liked his description of the shows and what his thought on tours in general are.

I think one thing is when you go on tour, like every friend that I have that gets a record deal and gets to go out on tour, they just go.

And we went and almost all of them hit a wall of some kind or another.

And it's not even a bad thing. Like people make runs and it's an amazing experience. It's not a bad thing necessarily.

Like I don't regret anything that really we've done because I didn't know what I knew before that.

But something we're going to do different now, I think, is just, you know, I think how you schedule a tour.

Like, well, let's do that. And we got to go to we have to go to Pittsburgh and D.C. and Cleveland.

And it's really, really hard to quantify it like that. You can't just go and be everywhere.

And to be in demand is a wonderful thing.

But if you just go, it's a wonderful thing because it means you get to do what you love for a long time, many times.

But if you just go and you're not replenishing yourself with reasons to make music or you're not necessarily figuring out ways to change the music you have.

Like Bon Iver went on tour with like less than 10 songs for like a long time.

And and we did a good job, you know, and it was really fun and we had the best of times.

You burn out on that.

Curating a different show every time you get on stage, trying to figure out specific ways that you can make this experience different each and every time.

I love that. I love that part of the artistry of this.

Yeah, it's you know, you and I don't tour. We don't perform.

Just wait, just wait.

Wait until I get my indie band that doesn't exist together yet.

I think it's sometimes hard to understand that what he's talking about.

We you know, years and years we've heard of the Neil Youngs and the Dylans and the Van Morrison's who have a reputation of being sort of hard to deal with or persnickety or whatever.

And I think it comes down to kind of what he's just talking about is it's not just call it in every night.

You know, it's not 200 nights of the same thing or it shouldn't be the guys like that.

It has to mean something.

So that would be tough to put yourself out there and rip yourself open every night and look out at you know blank faces staring back at you.

Right. And then creating a level of expectation for yourself that you have to match every single day.

That too.

You know, I don't know the reasons why he canceled half of his tour as soon as 22 a million came out.

I don't know why, but I can probably figure it out.

I can probably figure out based on the kind of guy that he is.

Yeah.

He's trying. He's trying to set a very high bar and match it every single time he goes on stage, which is why.

Did you see the story of how Bon Iver put together a dance show?

Yes.

So the other night in some sort of, was it a Wisconsin theater?

I think it was Chicago.

OK, so they mash up a dance collaboration.

They put a collaboration with the dance troupe and Bon Iver songs and it was highly regarded.

The reviews of this show were just through the roof and how it was some about social and racial justice and some of it was just pretty.

Dancing along with Bon Iver songs. He debuted new material.

I mean, if you start trying to ask yourself, what is this show going to be at Bon Iver?

Uh oh, here's another wrinkle.

I mean, it could be, he could bring out the dance troupe and have that as your late night witch show.

And see, isn't that interesting? Because as a fan, I would like to see that show.

I think I would too.

But I understand why he can't do that every night.

Do you know what I mean? It's that thing.

He's not necessarily Beyonce. It's pretty tough.

Right. So I mean, it's an interesting dilemma.

There are certain artists I mentioned, Van Morrison, that is on my bucket list.

But in the back of my head, I'm thinking if it's a good Van Morrison show, you know, he might do what he wants to do.

And it might not be what I wanted to see.

So then there's that question of is it his responsibility to give me what I paid my money for?

Or is it my responsibility to accept what he wants to present?

That is a great question. And I think of it like I go to a restaurant, right?

Some restaurants, like Hole in the Wall Mexican Joint, I want it exactly the way that I want it.

But if I'm going to a five-star Michelin-starred restaurant, I'm taking whatever you're giving me, pal.

You're the artist here, not me. Just give me whatever you think my palate needs.

That's a great point. And hopefully you knew that when you went into the restaurant.

Right. And if you didn't, it's on you.

It's on you. Yeah, I agree.

I'm not one that has to hear the hits the exact same way they're on the radio from certain artists.

As long as it's honest and well presented.

You know, Paul McCartney went for a decade where I guess he was tired of doing them all the same way.

And I didn't care for what he was doing.

The show we saw four or five years ago, on the other hand, was great.

So, you know, it's a tough call and I get it.

I can't imagine. And, you know, you've interviewed artists as well as I have that play the same thing over and over and over and over.

I can't imagine what that's like. But I also, you know, they'll tell you that pays the bills.

Yeah. So, I mean, it's an interesting question.

Well, the question comes back to what is the show going to be?

And if I look through Info Room, I look through Reddit and I talk to at least some people who may know what's going on.

Here's what I'm putting my money on.

You got a, like Ashley said, a regular Bon Iver show and then play $22 million in its entirety.

It would take you about 45 minutes with short and set times at Bon Iver, by the way, which I want to talk about here in a little bit because the schedule came out this week.

Is he plays $22 million completely and then the second set is basically a super jam of artists that he wants to join.

Yeah, I wondered about that too. That would be cool.

I think that it would work. I mean, he's played with James Blake. Kanye loves him. He's adored by the industry.

I don't see how that doesn't work.

Yeah.

Now, I'm not going to say no to the dance troupe showing up and doing that either.

Yeah. You know, a question that I just thought of, I wish we had asked Ashley is whose idea was it for him to do, for them to do two sets?

I wonder if they already had in mind they wanted to do two or if Ashley and that group of five that does the booking offered it.

I don't know. That would be curious.

Oh,

was

the

first time that he did the booking the first time that he did the booking.

So, he writes this beautiful folksy indie, you know, acoustic guitar based album for Emma Forever ago.

Then he decides to plug in the guitars, add some horns, talks to Bruce Hornsby and writes Bon Iver Bon Iver.

That was 2012. Right? 2008, 2012.

did this for and then he gets nominated for a Grammy best new artist he wins a

best new artist Grammy four years after his original album comes out how does

that happen I did happens all the time I have no idea that yeah guys a third

record will get nominated for best new it makes no sense I don't put much now

now I remember that year because when bony bear one best new artists there

were two responses on Twitter it was this guy's been around forever if

forever four years and then to who is bony bear one or the other there's

nothing in between well it wasn't a lot of top 40 hits I don't think yeah no

not for bony bear the hair now and was that the first time that you sort of

engaged with that was that your first interaction yes I think so as I've said

before a lot of my listening especially in that period was based around my kids

who were teenagers so discovering right definitely bone of air fell into that

mix wasn't something that I found it was something that was you know probably

played in the car in the in the house and you had a young daughter I'm shocked

that she wasn't playing you skinny love she had to have been she was yeah yeah

she was and I mean I was aware of it it just wasn't on my playlist mm-hmm I mean

I knew it and liked it now when you listen back to it now and and seeing how

the career and the the shape of his music has changed and shifted so much

what was your impression going from album one to album two I just thought

the sound and I want to make another point CDs and playlists and Spotify and

all that I don't know how you were you're probably better at knowing names

because you have to in your line of work there was a lot of music I was listening

to that I couldn't tell you who the artist right just because it was on the

you know the shuffle it was made for you made for me and you know it we're spoiled

now where it shows up on a screen on your radio or whatever but but back then

it didn't really so there was a lot of music that I probably listened to and

knew and liked I mean as an aside I hate to make this top 40 but it was

remarkable in our industry at least in my industry where Rihanna had what for

number one singles and we couldn't as a radio station give those tickets away

when she would come around town you know why nobody knew who she was yeah nobody

knew who Rihanna was yeah she had top single as number one single after number

one single she was just a sound that people understood now she's a major star

that you know it would never in a million years would you find somebody

who doesn't know Rihanna is unless they're in a cabin in Wisconsin under a

snow pile but but that's to your point yeah it was curated for us for a long

time and if you didn't go out and search and find it and absorb it it could live

in the background forever yes I mean I can think now of December us or one of

those bands that I couldn't have told you the name right but I listen to it

all the time December us vampire weekend one of those things exactly it sounds

good when it's on it fits my mood at vampire weekend for sure Portugal the

man yeah a lot of that stuff I just who is that who is that and who is bony

there he gets that second album bony bear bony bear written by bony bear

performed by bony bear and he gets nominated for best new artist that's

weird the best new artist has been around for four years is incredibly

strange but to have a by the way I was at that Grammys that year when bony bear

won I was legitimately standing up nobody around me like what and who and

the hell is going I'm just losing my mind excited so bony bear gets wins the

best new artist Grammy the one that shocked me was he was nominated for song

of the year how does a random independent artist who's on the record

label Jag Jag Jaguar what is it Jag Jag Jag Jag Jag Jag Jag you are yeah I don't

even know who they are how does that happen don't you think though that

sometimes the industry reacts weirdly weirdly and he talks about that a lot he

speaks about how much he dislikes the industry and award shows and awards in

general and recognition because of that because of how weird it is and there's

really no sense to it no and it's it's like a rubber band theory it stretches so

far and then it reacts weirdly and then it goes back to the way it was so that

maybe just one of those years where people tried to make a point whatever it

was and and he happened to be the the beneficiary I guess if you want to call

so

And you're walking off your feet

And once I knew I was not magnificent

You're straight above the highway

Shake it, make it, stick with the rest

But I could see for miles, miles, miles

Shake it, make it, stick with the rest

Shake it, make it, stick with the rest

Shake it, make it, stick with the rest

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

You're a walk-by

Is the company started?

We had what we wanted, your eyes

When we leave this room, this car

With no word from the phone

I'd be happy as hell if you stayed for tea

I know so well that this is all there is

This is how we grow now, a child ignored

These will just be places to be now

The forming is down

When we leave this room, this car

With no words from the phone

I'd be happy as hell if you stayed for tea

I know so well that this is all there is

I'd be happy as hell if you stayed for tea

I'd be happy as hell if you stayed for tea

I'd be happy as hell if you stayed for tea

I'd be happy as hell if you stayed for tea

Stayed at the Ace Hotel

If the call would allow

I would just be floating to you now

You make it past and let it pass

I'm climbing the dance, that's it

Alright Barry Courter, we're gonna play a brand new game

We're adding a brand new game to the What Podcast today, alright? You ready?

I'm ready

Alright, is it a Boney Bear lyric or did I just make it up?

Okay, alright, so Boney Bear, if there's anything that gets me the most about Justin and his songwriting

is he literally just makes up words

He makes up words and he writes songs

Like a lot of times he'll write songs and just hum out sounds

and he'll create words that just fit the sound that he's looking for

That's what I find so creative about him

Like he will just pull words out of thin air

I wish I could do that in my writing

You should, try it

That makes no sense

I've probably been accused of it

Well, when you're trying to spell my name, yeah, it's pretty bad

He'll just pull words out of thin air just because it fits the sound that he wants

Alright, so I'm gonna play a little game

Is it a Boney Bear lyric or did I just make it up?

Clever name, right?

Alright, here we go

I'm unorphaned in our northern lights, dedicating every daemon taken in the tall grass of the mountain cable

Did I make that up or is that a real Boney Bear lyric?

I'm gonna say based on your description, that is a real lyric

That is a real Boney Bear lyric

Alright, here's another one

Even in my daemons come talk for a finer cause

Only love for long along with every grimy word

Real Boney Bear lyric or did I just make it up?

I don't think you could make that up

Hmm, you think it's a real Boney Bear lyric?

I think it's a real lyric

I just made it up

That's good

We'll do one more

You channeled your...that's good

Alright, let's do one more

I was unafraid, I was a boy, I was a tinder age, mellick in the naked, knew a lake and drew the lofts for page

Oh man

That is an actual Boney Bear lyric from Michigan

Yes, it's a very tough game, isn't it?

Let me say, the song that you played just before we came back is the one that I thought my stereo at home was broken

That's the one where I heard people talking on the other side of the wall

It is a bizarre album but that's what I love about it

And the reason why I love these lyrics so much even though they don't make any sense sometimes

Serious music people will find definition in what they want to find

And sometimes I think we take all of this way too seriously, we think way too much about it

Sometimes I think Justin is just putting stuff out there because it sounds right and he wants to let you be the decider

Let you figure it out and go from there, he'll take whatever it is you say

Not to get too deep into the woods but there is a trend in the art world and I'm really glad to see it

Part of my job at the paper, I write about everything, music just is one of them

But serious museums like the one we have here

You're talking about song birds, the guitar music

No, I'm talking about the Hunter Museum of American Art, paintings, oil paintings

The theory used to be you had to have an education, you had to know about brush stroke and color

And what was the artist trying to say and all that and it turned a lot of people off

It created this whole perception of art snob type of thing and there's a real trend now

And our museum is one of them, it's whatever you see

If it makes you think of childhood or whatever

I'll stop you right there, if it makes you think

If it makes you feel, think anything

You can't explain why, you don't care why, if it just makes you smile or it makes you feel sad or whatever

That is your honest feeling

It's a big change, it's a very serious change

I think that's a long way of saying what you were just saying

And that's the point of what he puts into that music is if it's tinkling glasses, then it works

And it's definitely not going to follow a chorus, verse, verse, chorus structure

And he talks about that, speaking of art, I've often said it's like going from

For Emma and then Bon Iver all the way to 22 A Million

It's almost like if Picasso decided to stop doing what he was doing and just start painting football games

It wouldn't make any sense and he talks about that transition into 22 A Million

The moment for me was when I was making the second song, the song that was supposed to come directly second

And that's actually been around quite a long time

It's called 10 Death Breasts now but it was called Lester Check for a long time after our friend Ben Lester

Kind of helped us make it, that song

But we had it very early on, me and B.J. Burton had this drum loop

And it just sounded broken down like he said and messed up a little bit

And personally what I was going through and what I found other people are going through is a lot of anxiety

And things like that and that for me got me up out of my seat and made me want to break it down

Crush something or do something, it was aggressive sounding

So when I had that going on it was almost finished basically right when we made it

So we had to sit on it for three years or whatever it's been

But that kind of is a song, a caveat I guess if you will, that I wanted to build around

And that was like, alright this sounds like breaking open a new fabric or something

Feel the words

You make me feel

I've been sitting in a stable late

Not gonna do you no favors

But I gotta still try

I'm shaking down the only gates

Fuck you son

Die with a love I

Lose, don't fight

But I'll wrap you up

That is the moment when I'm probably going to lose my mind at the WITCH stage at Bonnarooo 2018

I cannot wait for Bon Iver and I am apologizing to you right now Barry

I am going to be talking about this probably every day until I see it

Weeping, crying, mush

I could not be more excited about Bon Iver

It's gonna be good, it's gonna be fun

Alright so as we get closer to Bonnarooo I think it, if we can give you a suggestion

And I'm telling you this because I haven't talked to you about this Barry, it's meeting time

It's time to, I suggest that you get your camp mates together and start talking about camp

You start planning camp, you start making your schedule, talk about the schedule with your camp mates

Everybody comes with their list of don't miss acts, surprise acts, secret acts

And by the way, if you haven't gotten Bonnarooo tickets, go ahead and get them now and be a part of the fun

Join in

So I wanna do a meeting, let's have a meeting

Let's have a meeting

You wanna get the Camp Nut Butter guys together?

Yep, Camp Nut Butter, we need to call a Camp Nut Butter meeting

What do you think, next Sunday after the podcast?

Yeah there you go

I like it, alright

Good idea

You're buying the beers?

Maybe we can even have them in, that'd be interesting

The whole camp?

We could do a Camp Nut Butter podcast

Oh my god

That'd be funny

Let's think about that

How about this, let's invite them in and we'll record it

But let's not promise it's gonna ever make it to the air because I don't know how well it's gonna go

That's a good idea

It's just too many inside jokes

I just wanna mention what we do have planned, we hope, you mentioned First Aid Kit

I'd love to talk to First Aid Kit, I love those girls

Hoping that happens this week, Mike from Relix was kind enough to reach out

I think we're gonna have him on

That'd be awesome

That'd be really cool

They do the, is it the Beacon?

Yeah, the Bonnarooo Beacon

Bonnarooo Beacon, they print the newspaper every day

He's been there every year except the first one I think

So he'll have some really cool insights

I can't wait, that sounds like a blast

Yeah, and your guy, Labelhead

Yeah, guy from Columbia Records, one of the top guys from Columbia Records

Who stops by our camp each and every year just to be amongst the camp nut butter nonsense

I can't remember his exact title, but he's one of those guys that when he walks into the room

You're like, oh, the entire Columbia Records entourage is here, gotcha

I'd love to talk to him and get his perspective on what the festival means to him specifically

And more generally, where the industry is for festivals

I can't wait to talk to him because he's like Ashley when we talk to him

They are in the business as we are, but they're music fans

He goes and does the festivals

Right, so we're in the business, they are the business

They are the business, exactly

Alright, we'll talk to you next week on The What Podcast

Thank you

TheWhatPodcast.com, at TheWhat underscore podcast on Twitter, bye